Hi Everyone from a proud new HR-V owner.

[Lyon222]

Hi All

Im the proud new owner of a 02 reg 3 door HR-V in Black. This car was sold to me as a VTEC but when I got it home and showed it to a mechanic friend he noticed that its the 1.6 sohc. A couple of furious phone calls later to my Honda dealership and they have agreed to source a Vtec model same year in black for me......it looks like im gonna get the best of both worlds Vtec and non Vtec.

I have just a couple of questions.. the worst thing about the car so far is FM radio reception especially Radio 4. has anyone else found this to be a weak point and are there any boosters/ etc available that work well?
Also this is my 1st air con car so i have nothing to judge it by but it doesnt seem to cool things down very well....do i need to leave it on for a while before it starts to work properly?

I drove it pretty carefully for the 1st two weeks and was returning a healthy 395 miles per tank full before the fuel light came on....BUT :) since finding this web site ive started to 'Enjoy' whats beneath the bonnet.. it really is a fun car to drive.

Best Regards to all the other happy Harvey owners out there.

Jack. (Shropshire)

[mrtn]

welcome, jack!

that's some funny hassle, hope it didn't cause you that much grey hair.

regarding your radio - check the aerial connector behind the receiver, it might as well fallen off or have a bad connection.

[PatrickDorrian]

Hi and welcome to the board Jack. I've got a VTEC too, i don't know about maximum fuel to a tank but i know i've emptied it in 142 miles from full to fuel light on :-)

[Lyon222]

Patrick Hi

were you using the VTec constantly to get such a poor fuel return? Is there a big difference between Vtec and Non Vtec as regards fuel consumption or is it
all about how the car is driven? I ask because ive been giving my non vtec some welly over the last week / 10 days and only saw a 15 mile decrease in fuel performance. down to 385 miles before the fuel light came on.

How safe / sensible is it to 'punish' this engine into submission bearing in mind that I upgraded from a steady Suzuki Wagon R *cough :)

Best Wishes


Jack.

[PatrickDorrian]

Well if you ask Mr Dastardly and myself the answer is "thrash it to within one inch of its life".

When i'm returning 140 miles to a tank, i'm usually playing in 1st and 2nd gear and that means engine revs are up above 4000rpm most of the time.

On an average drive, i can bank on about ten pounds of petrol for every 70 to 110 miles depending on how i drive and with what throttle pressure etc.

[Dick_Dastardly]

Ahhh the virtues of the high rev engine.......

Honda were one of the pioneers of the high rev engine, a somewhat diferent philosiphy than what we were mostly used to, which has it's roots in the motorbike engine.

High rev engines require very precise engineering, perfect balance. coupled with lightweight, low inertia parts. Not a simple thing to make, even today. In order to do this Honda have to make virtually all parts in house to ensure that tolerances are kept within at all times, a few grammes off balance on any part could destroy the engine at high revs, or at best prevent it from developing max output.
Most Honda engines are developing max power around 6500 to 6700 rpm, and will pull all the way to the red line. Just try it, put your foot down in first and wait for the power to fade at the top end before changing gear.....oops! rev limiter. That's right, more revs = more power. and there is a computer to stop you going too far.

One advantage of a good high revving engine being used at the top of it's rev range is that it actually puts less stress on the engine itself. It's rather like when you cycle up hill in a low gear, sure your legs are going like mad, but you are putting less pressure on the drivetrain. go up a few gears and you dont have to pedal as fast, but you sure have to strain those muscles to get up that hill, either way you deliver the same power to the wheel.

The problem in the past was most general engines were of quite basic and rough mechanical construction, (some still are) and were not well balanced enough, or suficiently low mass, to be able to sustain high revs, so most were tuned for lower rev peak outputs. requiring stronger and heavier drivetrains.
Most drivers are used to using these engines and have adapted their style accordingly, instinct tells them to change to a higher gear at about 2500 or 3000 rpm. By 5000 rpm these engines are starting to fade, and a drop in output is noticed. there is no point in revving any higher as the car wont go any faster in that gear, and the engine is percieved to struggle.

The Honda D16 used in the HR-V starts to produce a reasonable pull at about 3,000 rpm and continues pulling smoothly to 7,000 rpm giving you a constant delivery of increasing power for 4,000rpm. if you use this range, you can change from gear to gear without hitting any deadspots. but if you have not driven with a high rev engine before it may make you feel like you're hurting it. YOU ARE NOT! that's how it works best.
Below 2,500 rpm it has nothing worth mentioning.
I have had friends drive my car and complain that it is weak, but if you are going to change gear before the engine starts developing power that's what you'll get. Let it rev....

In your passenger footwell you have a tiny mechanic from Honda (no white coat) watching your every move it's name is PGM-FI and it tunes your engine many times per second, it makes sure that everything is working as intended. try and rev it to high. it stops you. try and give it too much gas it restricts it to just enough to perform to the optimum. There are around 40 sensors on this ECU all monitoring the performance. So any chance or really thrashing the engine to death is all but gone. Only somthing real stupid would hurt it.

My 02 HR-V is now getting towards 90,000 miles, most have been done above 4,000 rpm, and I don't hang about if I can help it. there is no signs of abnormal wear on the vehicle, and I've had Ford and Peugeot hire vehicles with less than 20,000 miles on them that feel more worn than my car at 85k.




As for fuel economy The D16 in the HR-V is quite highly tuned for performance. The non VTEC 1.6 HR-V is only 5hp down on the VTEC D16 in the civic sport so economy was a secondary consideration. Overall I can now get a reasonable 300 - 320 miles from a full tank (50 litres) traveling at 85 - 90 most the way. (4500 rpm)

If you kick ass around town, you can empty the tank real quick... Solution? (if it's a problem) back off on the attempts to get to 30mph under 3 sec. (Boo Hiss)

[PatrickDorrian]

Take a bow Sir - how eloquently put :-)

Oh yes - i now have an induction kit fitted and i've not been off the VTEC for the last 6 days!!!

[etc]

Dick - very good indeed - you should write a novel or something :)

[AoS]

Im the proud new owner of a 02 reg 3 door HR-V in Black. This car was sold to me as a VTEC but when I got it home and showed it to a mechanic friend he noticed that its the 1.6 sohc.
The HR-V VTEC is a 1.6 SOHC as well ... not all VTEC are DOHC :wink:

[Lyon222]

Thanks Mr Dasterdly for putting my mind at rest. I had no idea that everything was computer controlled on the HR-V. Its good to know that there are safeguards inbuilt and the way you explain how it all works when I put my foot down is fantastic.... you really should write a book!!
Ive only got 23k on my HR-V so lots and lots of driving fun to be had yet. The salesman who sold me the car told me theres not been one Vtec engine recalled after 17 million sales and it should be good for 200k miles with regular oil and filter changes. Not sure whether to believe him or not after all he also told me that my car had a Vtec engine :(

Your right about it not having much power in the lower revs especially going up hills .. but as my driving style is slowly changing to take this into account I can see and feel the benefits of putting pedal to metal.

I read that there are Vtec controllers for sale that sit in the dashboard and make it possible to lower the point at which the vtec kicks in??? is this a big job to get one installed and are they worth the cash?


Tomorrow night my wife and I travel up to the Manchester apollo to see a concert so Im gonna open her up on the motorway (not the wife) for the first time...... Yeeehaa :)

Best regards to all of you


Jack.

[etc]

so Im gonna open her up on the motorway
(not the wife)
:lol: :lol: :lol: well i wish you similar pleasure :wink:

[PatrickDorrian]

Ahhh the virtues of the high rev engine.......

If you kick ass around town, you can empty the tank real quick... Solution? (if it's a problem) back off on the attempts to get to 30mph under 3 sec. (Boo Hiss)

Attempts??? What do you mean attempts - i launch the thing off go with around 3500 on the clock and laugh like an idiot as you stuff just about everything else off the lights but don't break the speed limit - 1st gear runs out at exactly 30mph for me :-)

[Team GOOOSH]

Hi everyone, this is my first time, so go easy on me. I'm from Australia where the HRV was discontinues over two years ago. We never go a Vtec option. My 1.6l used to only do up to 450kms a tank untill its first 40,000kms. Now (90,000kms) average 600kms per tank. Funny enough it does NOT matter if a drive like my grandad or thrash it to death either busy city stop/start oo open country roads and highways, it always returns the same distance per tank (funny hey). I guess it must be my economic driving style. :D

Im also wondering if anyone has experienced any problems with a rattle (sound like pinging/knocking) on full throttle acceleration at about 5,000rpm? When car was new it always did it, but now i have not noticed it as i have become more happy as a economical driver. (our petrol cost $1.20 per litre and will rise this month to $1.40 per litre (ouch).

Any info on this rattle would be great.

Cheers.

[PatrickDorrian]

Oil!!!!!!


Have you checked it? If you thrash your honda, it will use oil - nothing to worry about but you should check it every so often and more so when you hear noises that you don't like.

Pot of oil that you might not need - a few dollars. A new engine cos you seized it ... several thousand dollars ;)

[Team GOOOSH]

Thanks Patrick. I have had it looked at by three different Honda Dealer service centres while it was under warranty. None could rectify the problem. One did try to fix the problem by retarding the camshaft timing from 12Deg down to 9Deg(you can imagine what that did to performance). The car was a snail and could not get up minor hills it was that low on performance.

I was so upset that no one at Honda wanted to aknowledge or fix the problem. By chance i happened to meet a mechanic in Sydney who used to work at the Honda engine factory where this engine was built. He moved to australia many years ago to work on the pit team of Wayne Gardner and Mick Doohans Honda Bike team.

Anyway this guy (Robert) now runs his own workshop in Sydney and only works on Hondas. He is a freak of nature. He went over my engine and sorted out the pinging noise and also raised the cam timing up to a massive 14deg advance without the engine pinging and now it goes like hell!!!!!

I only use this guy for all my servicing on my HRV. HANNYS PERFRORMANCE at Smithfield in Sydney. Robert knows a few factory tricks to tickle the engine and boy has it made a big difference.

But every so often i can still hear a slight rattle like sound on full throttle at 5000rpm. I does not worry me. But it just sounds like Shite.

I did notice that when i used Premium fuel there was less rattle BUT found that SHELL OPTIMAX made the rattle the worst. Yeh i couldnt believe it But Robert The mechanic told me that the denser fuel in Optimax was dangerous for Hondas. Now i only uses Mobil 8000 Synergy and i never hear the rattle. Unfortunatly it costs me $1.25 per litre (ouch).

[PatrickDorrian]

you sure someone hasn't fitted an ecotek vakve?

[Dick_Dastardly]

????

I've done 85,000 miles on Optimax, never a rattle. and more MPG.

[Team GOOOSH]

Sorry Patrick but what do you mean "ecotek vakve"?

Here in australia i have heard a few complaints from 4 cyl engine owners who found Optimax to be too dense. But Big V8 drivers love it.

[PatrickDorrian]

It's a sprung loaded non return valve that people fit into their vacuum line between the intake manifold and the brake cylinder. It's sold as an economy aid, i've got one fitted purely because it feels like it sharpens throttle response :-)

I also use optimax and haven't the problem with rattling either, in fact given the way i drive it most of the time i;m surprised it's not one big rattle :)

[Team GOOOSH]

Thanks Patrick,

I will have a look at the engine bay for the valve as soon as possible.

Since i last posted message i had a crash in the car!!!!!

Some young kid just new to driving hit me hard up the back side in his CRV and sent me into another car in front.

Funny though the CRV behind and the car in front were both wipped out completely but mine only suffered some bumper damage. Chalk that 1 point for the HRV toughness!!!!!!!!

But now that the car will be brought back to new with the insurance work, i am now keen on progressing to some serious body and engine work.

I will keep everyone posted.