Would you want a Hybrid CR-V?

[kuyastib]

Just starting a topic....

Should Honda start researching a Hybrid CR-V? And would you buy one?

[Red Wagon]

I would have had one been available in '02. I commute BIG time. 27+ mpg (hwy) is great, but w/Hybrid tech. in the V, we could be getting upper 30's I suppose.
I guess it would have been nice to have had a choice.

[roadster]

yep indeed, but man I would hate to replace those batteries? maybe after 5 more years they still need to get al the tech's informed on how to repair them? I had seen the honda insight???? pass me by at 70 mph, and well a crv would be great. the escape I believe is going to hit in april hybred but I would not sell mine yet. I was just complimented again wow such a quiet car I did not hear you back up......

[bracky]

I'm hoping my next vehicle might be just that. :)

[wangofree]

Although the cost of daily operation would be great, the hybrid is a well engineered concept that relys on low drag coefficient design - and I gotta tell ya, the CR-V is anything but.

I would hold out for the hydrogen fuel cell technology.

[02CR-V]

Honda just announced a Hybrid Accord for '05 (ivtec you missed that one). Being at the forefront of the technology I would expect some Honda SUV to have the technology but it probably won't be the CR-V since the mileage is relatively good already. They would put it in a larger vehicle to help their overall MPG.

But yes I would buy a Hybrid vehicle and fully expect my next purchase to be one. It's the future.

[kuyastib]

Although the cost of daily operation would be great, the hybrid is a well engineered concept that relys on low drag coefficient design - and I gotta tell ya, the CR-V is anything but.

I would hold out for the hydrogen fuel cell technology.

--What if...
...you could lower the ground clearance for highway driving?
...have automatic adjusting spoilers (Mits 3000GT VR-4)?
...you still had the all-weather/ off-road drivability / reliability by employing an advanced version of RTAWD?

[BigBen]

If Toyota can make a Hybrid Highlander, I'm sure that Honda can make a Hybrid CR-V. Hybrid is definitely the future, for me it just depends on how much it costs.

[jasbus]

If Toyota can make a Hybrid Highlander, I'm sure that Honda can make a Hybrid CR-V. Hybrid is definitely the future, for me it just depends on how much it costs.

WhoopWhoopWhoop, we have a winner!!!!
That's my beef, sure, they get great gas mileage, but does it really cut the cost enough to pay the extra on the window sticker? Not to mention, the costs of replacing the batteries after a couple of years...

[Bishop's Catmobile]

I'll hold out for the Micro-Nuclear mini reactor! :lol:
Just think, you'd never have to buy fuel, ever! :wink: The only downside
would be if you wrecked, or disposing of the nuclear waste. :(

[bigdongers]

the hybrid will carry a premium over the standard models. plus the batteries need replacing every 10 years. the cost of the replacement batteries is so high that its not worth doing. thats why there really isnt much of a 2nd hand market for them.

its true the car has to be designed to minimize drag. otherwise the improvement in fuel consumption will be minimal. the power output of hybrids are also lower so its not really designed for a car like the CRV where owners need good torque.

[Einstein]

In all cases thusfar, the batteries for a hybrid cost more than the gasoline saved over the life of the batteries.

Therefore, I would only buy a hybrid if the batteries were lifetime guaranteed.

[CRIANA]

I am totally for a hybrid CRV.

And as far as the added expenses: higher sticker cost and expensive batteries - if it makes enough of a difference in the environment -- I'd be willing to try to stretch my dollar bills.

[CR-Vince]

I am in agreement with CRIANA: You won't win the $$$ battle by going hybrid, but there are other windfalls to be gained by lessening our dependence on petroleum.

Also, hybrid technology does not rely on superior aerodynamics. These two independent concepts combine to produce the high MPG rating on the cars we see. Notice that the Toyota Prius actually has a higher EPA fuel economy rating in the city than on the highway. In the city, the advantage of an aerodyamic body shape is less pronounced, and frequent braking means that the hybrid system gets more opportunity to do its thing.

This leads to an interesting point: The "magic" of hybrids comes from the ability to recapture kinetic energy normally lost during braking. At any given speed, a heavier vehicle has more kinetic energy than a lighter vehicle. There is more energy to be recaptured from a stopping 2-ton SUV than a compact car with half the weight. In my opinion, it is actually more important to get truck, van, and SUV buyers to embrace hybrid tech than it is for the compact car market to do the same.

Finally, don't forget that gas-electric hybrid tech isn't just good for saving gas. An electric motor is capable of immediately unleashing its maximum torque at a time when a gasoline engine is just starting to build its RPM. Think about it. 8)

[bracky]

The new lexus RX400h looks pretty smooth. They claim it has a 20% increase in power over the RX330 yet gets the fuel economy of a compact sedan.

[stevedebi]

I am totally for a hybrid CRV.

And as far as the added expenses: higher sticker cost and expensive batteries - if it makes enough of a difference in the environment -- I'd be willing to try to stretch my dollar bills.
Just a couple of notes: After factoring in the environmental impact of producing and disposing of the batteries, I am not sure if the hybrids are more environmentally sound, over a 300,000 mile life (for example), than a similar gasoline engine. Most estimates on the battery life are about 150,000 miles, so plan on at least one replacement on a Honda vehicle...

Same problem with the future hydrogen fuel cells - how is that hydrogen to be produced?

All too often we fail to consider all aspects of enviornmentalism - namely, how is the bottom line of polution affected by our decisions?

[bracky]

Same problem with the future hydrogen fuel cells - how is that hydrogen to be produced?

Thats the magic question. The magic answer is its made from water. :) Its a simple process to extract the hydrogen from water.

[stevedebi]

Same problem with the future hydrogen fuel cells - how is that hydrogen to be produced?

Thats the magic question. The magic answer is its made from water. :) Its a simple process to extract the hydrogen from water.
Yes, I remember my high school chemistry. I was not asking about the source of the hydrogen, but rather how much energy is required to separate the oxygen from the hydrogen? And where is that energy coming from? We are talking large amounts, not a simple lab experiment. It wouldn't make much sense, for example, to make the hydrogen using energy from coal fired electrical plants...

[Einstein]

I thought battery life is more like 80,000 miles?

How about the energy and materials that go into making the batteries, is that environmentally clean?

----

Instead of making 1% of new cars hybrid at such a huge cost to gain 10-20 MPG, they need to increase make efforts to improve the fuel economy of 100% of new cars 10-20%. The first has little impact on the environment, the latter is a revolution.

A big step will be by changing over from 12V systems to 42V systems. This will reduce weight of wiring and components. It will make it efficient to run engine valves, power steering, and air conditioning from electricity when needed, instead of being constantly driven from a power-sapping belt on the engine. Some hybrid technology can be applied, such as brake regeneration, engine shut-off, and inline boost motor that doubles as a starter.

Hybrids are a way to introduce certain technologies into the market. Eventually the differentiation between a conventional gasoline engine and a full hybrid will be blurred.

[Vigor25]

yes, I would definately favour a hybrid CR-V since my family use the CR-V usually for long trips....

however with the increased price, it is tempting to get a midsize SUV instead.


The complexity of the hybrid design will only mean high servicing costs IMO

[autox02altima]

And where is that energy coming from? We are talking large amounts, not a simple lab experiment. It wouldn't make much sense, for example, to make the hydrogen using energy from coal fired electrical plants..

Indeed. In fact it takes more power to make hydrogen out of water than you get out of burning it. Why that's rarely mentioned in the press is beyond me. It's not a minor point.

[N_Jay]

And where is that energy coming from? We are talking large amounts, not a simple lab experiment. It wouldn't make much sense, for example, to make the hydrogen using energy from coal fired electrical plants..

Indeed. In fact it takes more power to make hydrogen out of water than you get out of burning it. Why that's rarely mentioned in the press is beyond me. It's not a minor point.

(Lets see how many people I can insult in one shot?)

Maybe because the people in the press studied how to write, rather than how think?

[CRIANA]

All too often we fail to consider all aspects of enviornmentalism - namely, how is the bottom line of polution affected by our decisions?

If you consider, in one year a car produces it's total weight in carbon dioxide. And we now consume 4 bls of oil to 1 discovered.

I'm thinking something needs to change. I'm sure people are already working on a way to do something more efficient with the batteries from hybrids. And this isn't the only way, and hydrogen isn't the only other alternative.

Check out http://www.challengebibendum.com

[bing]

I'd favor hybrid as well. Heck, I was considering the Prius after sitting in one at the LA auto show!

Anyway, I had a physics professor (used to be an ex-Russian nuclear scientist) said 15 years ago that the future of vehicles will be hydrogen! Man, I can still remember sitting in class listening to him go off about how that's the best source because the ultimate byproduct is water.

Anyways, I think my point is, he mentioned something about using electricity to do the separation...darn, I guess I wasn't paying attention because I don't see how that works?

K...more research needs to be done! :-)
Bing

[N_Jay]

All too often we fail to consider all aspects of enviornmentalism - namely, how is the bottom line of polution affected by our decisions?

If you consider, in one year a car produces it's total weight in carbon dioxide. And we now consume 4 bls of oil to 1 discovered.

I'm thinking something needs to change. I'm sure people are already working on a way to do something more efficient with the batteries from hybrids. And this isn't the only way, and hydrogen isn't the only other alternative.


The only thing that determines the WEIGHT of the CO2 that a car produces is to reduce the amount of gasoline it uses.

The LBs of CO2 issue is used by the environmentalists because they know that most of their intended target audience (the Media and the Politicians) don't know enough or don't think critically enough to figure out its a red hearing.

The engine does not CONSUME any of the carbon in the fuel. So, ALL the carbon that goes in comes out in the exhaust. Either as CO, un-burnt hydrocarbons, soot or CO2. Since we have spent the last 35 years reducing the first 3, most of the carbon leaves as CO2!

At this point the only way to reduce CO2 emissions is to reduce the amount of fuel used, or reduce the amount of carbon in the fuel!

[N_Jay]

Anyway, I had a physics professor (used to be an ex-Russian nuclear scientist) said 15 years ago that the future of vehicles will be hydrogen! Man, I can still remember sitting in class listening to him go off about how that's the best source because the ultimate byproduct is water.

Anyways, I think my point is, he mentioned something about using electricity to do the separation...darn, I guess I wasn't paying attention because I don't see how that works?

What most people do not realize is hydrogen is NOT a SOURCE of energy. It is simply a way to TRANSPORT energy.

All the energy released using hydrogen as a fuel (either through combustion or a fuel cell) comes from the energy put in when producing the hydrogen. There is no free lunch.

So the typical hydrogen powered car is realy an electric car that stores its charge as free hydrogen insted of the electrolyt inside a battery. The efficiancy equasion is the same.

A quick note on fuel cells:
They get lots of attention because they are PERCEIVED as a new technology, and therefore expected to improve rapidly. Fuel cells are in fact a fairly old and well understood technology. Over the past 30 years they have improved as have batteries and other energy storage and conversion systems. They have all improved at about the same rate, and I see nothing that would predict a change in that rate.
Today a well engineered fuel sell is ALMOST as efficient as a WELL ENGINEERED internal combustion engine!
Neither is as efficient as a well engineered rechargeable battery system, however the battery system is only part of the total drive system, and when you figure in the rest of the losses the internal combustion engine is still the winner.

[02CR-V]

As long as there are Petroleum companies there will always be gasoline powered vehicles, whether they are Hybrid or not. Look how long it took for AFVs to even make a minor impact (and it's very minor). Hydrogen Fuel Cells (and also Natural Gas) will be explored but IMO they will not be mass marketed in my lifetime. Too much depends on Petroleum-worldwide.

And I realize that Hybrids cost more, have to be driven longer to get payback, have potential maintenance issues, etc. but I'm still for them. I'm not even a typical Green person but I think AFVs of some sort is the way to go.

[jasbus]

What I find funny is, how everyone wants to help our environment by thinking about buying hybrid cars and whatnot.... But, in the end, still makes three trips a day to do what could have been done in one trip.. Never once has carpooled, and doesn't think twice about it. Does your 16 year old really need that car? etc, etc.
I'm no saint, I'm just saying...
I've said it before, Go save that rainforest, while you clear a 3 acre parcel for your house....

[N_Jay]

AFV? What the heck is an AFV?

It's a buzzword to keep people confused.

It's not the "BIG OIL COMPANIES" or any other imaginary, all controling, conspriacy that keeps petrolium as the basis of our energy source.
It is the simple fact, than "all considered" there is no better source TODAY, and "TODAY" will be here for a long time.


Jasbis is right.

The same issue comes into play the way we teach about "Recylcling", like it is THE answer.

What happened to the 3 "R"s? Reduce, Reuse, Recycle?

They are listed in order of importance and impact, yet the one with the LEAST importance and impact gets all the attention.

Most people don't think these issues through. Most media does a very poor job informing the public on these issues, and most advocates either intentionally or unintentionally misslead both the media and the public!

[2003 CR-V EX]

I would like a hybrid... IF the front & rear drive wheels were coordinated.

[CRIANA]

AFV? What the heck is an AFV?

It's a buzzword to keep people confused.

It's not the "BIG OIL COMPANIES" or any other imaginary, all controling, conspriacy that keeps petrolium as the basis of our energy source.
It is the simple fact, than "all considered" there is no better source TODAY, and "TODAY" will be here for a long time.


Jasbis is right.

The same issue comes into play the way we teach about "Recylcling", like it is THE answer.

What happened to the 3 "R"s? Reduce, Reuse, Recycle?

They are listed in order of importance and impact, yet the one with the LEAST importance and impact gets all the attention.

Most people don't think these issues through. Most media does a very poor job informing the public on these issues, and most advocates either intentionally or unintentionally misslead both the media and the public!

AFV = Alternate Fuel Vehicle -- it's all about marketing

I agree completely that the media spins things it's own way, and generally can not be trusted to spit back anything that is more 75% accurate.

Jasbus is right, we forget about alternative methods. Currently in my life, carpooling is not an option. Where I live, there is zero mass transit available to me. And I've looked into bicycling to work, what better way to cut back on pollution and get exercise. But I'm currently looking at 25 miles one way.

And with regards to the 3 acre parcel of land. My last house I lived in was on 3.25 acres, with a very small amount clear cut, 2.75 acres of my property was protected preservation property. I got to be a "holder" of the land, I could not build on it, but I got to enjoy the scenery and know that no one was going to throw up some exhorbinantly huge 4K sq.ft. house.

Consumerism is more of the problem. And the media doesn't exactly promote conservation or any of the three R's of Recycling.

[02CR-V]

It's not the "BIG OIL COMPANIES" or any other imaginary, all controling, conspriacy that keeps petrolium as the basis of our energy source. It is the simple fact, than "all considered" there is no better source TODAY, and "TODAY" will be here for a long time.

I disagree. Hasn't it not been proven that there are several technologies out there that will power a vehicle? Whether they are "better" can be debated forever, but they are there. Aren't there internal combustion engines that can produce close to triple digit mileage? So why aren't they on the market? And I don't think it is "imaginary".

I'm not going to get out my soapbox to tell you what I do for the environment. The simple fact for me is I like the idea of getting better mpg---whatever technology gives me it. And my feeling is it will be Hybrids, at least in my life.

[N_Jay]

I disagree. Hasn't it not been proven that there are several technologies out there that will power a vehicle? Whether they are "better" can be debated forever, but they are there.

No it has not been "Proven". There are many rumors and myths, but if you take the time to undersatnd how an engine works,m you will see that they are just rumors and myths.

They are where???


Aren't there internal combustion engines that can produce close to triple digit mileage? So why aren't they on the market? And I don't think it is "imaginary".

Nope, sorry, no 100MPG carborators, engines, or magic oils on the shelf!

These are the types of ideas that are propagated by a lack of understanding of the basic technologies we use on a daily basis.

I am not saying everyone has to understand every technology, but we MUST understand the basics of technology just the way we understand the basics of common-sense.
Without that it is far to easy to be misslead by others!

[Turnbud]

There's one major point that nobody has mentioned yet. In North America, particularly in the U.S., gasoline is TOO CHEAP! Don't get me wrong, I get pissed off every time I have to pay more, but that is and will always be the reason why granny and grandpa drive a Ford Excursion down to Florida every winter...because they can afford it! Let's face it - you look at the income of the average person who drives a large SUV in North America, then compare that to what they spend on fuel. To me it's a waste of money to spend more than I need to, but to many is barely noticeable. What's the incentive for people who don't give a rats ass that this stuff is going to run out and that we're killing the planet?

People in Switzerland and Austria do not drive Suburbans to work, they drive smaller vehicles, many of them turbodiesels, of which numerous more choices are available than in North America.

I'm all for these new technologies - whether they catch on mainstream just yet is not really a major concern - the fact that humanity is working on a solution for the future is comforting. Major change will happen, just maybe not in our lifetime.

I am comforted that some of you will actually admit that you would pay more for a more environmentally friendly vehicle - I'm that way to a point. In Canada, you can buy a Honda Civic for around $18-20k. The same vehicle in hybrid configuration is around $28K. Now, considering the basic civic can reliably get around 50mpg (imperial) on the highway, why on earth would I spend almost 50% more on the purchase price to get maybe 60 or 65mpg? That $10k buys a lot of gas, and the basic vehicle is more enviromentally friendly than 90% of the cars on the road today...

It's all in the numbers -economy of scale, I believe the economists call it. When these technologies become mainstream, and they only will when we decide that 15mpg on the highway with our Ford Expeditions is not affordable, then the price gap will reduce. It is likely that tax incentives would help this to happen too.

[stevedebi]

What most people do not realize is hydrogen is NOT a SOURCE of energy. It is simply a way to TRANSPORT energy.

All the energy released using hydrogen as a fuel (either through combustion or a fuel cell) comes from the energy put in when producing the hydrogen. There is no free lunch.


True, though actually, oil is not a source of energy either. It is a transport for all the energy stored up millions of years ago by the dinosaurs. It just took us a long time to reclaim the energy they created by eating all that Jurassic grass (or Jurassic dinosaurs, for the carnivores). The laws of thermodynamics cannot be beaten - matter is not created or destroyed, just changed in form.

[N_Jay]

What most people do not realize is hydrogen is NOT a SOURCE of energy. It is simply a way to TRANSPORT energy.

All the energy released using hydrogen as a fuel (either through combustion or a fuel cell) comes from the energy put in when producing the hydrogen. There is no free lunch.


True, though actually, oil is not a source of energy either. It is a transport for all the energy stored up millions of years ago by the dinosaurs. It just took us a long time to reclaim the energy they created by eating all that Jurassic grass (or Jurassic dinosaurs, for the carnivores). The laws of thermodynamics cannot be beaten - matter is not created or destroyed, just changed in form.

Very true, and many people KNOW this on an intelectual level.
What I find amazing is the number of people who do not UNDERSTAND this on a practical level.

As far as this discussion is concerened, we can consider fossel fuels as a primary source of energy along with nuclear and solar (including solar derivatives; hydro, biomass, wind, etc.).

As the discussion of these matters enters the general population, and they start making decisions (purchase decisions, political decisions, etc.) based on their beliefs, we will find ourselves in more and more trouble if a clear understanding is not common.

People must clearly understand the differences between an energy source, an energy storage/transport mechansim, and an energy conversion mechanism.

[stevedebi]

As the discussion of these matters enters the general population, and they start making decisions (purchase decisions, political decisions, etc.) based on their beliefs, we will find ourselves in more and more trouble if a clear understanding is not common.

People must clearly understand the differences between an energy source, an energy storage/transport mechansim, and an energy conversion mechanism.

Quite right, I was just making a tongue in cheek observation....

[autox02altima]

There's one major point that nobody has mentioned yet. In North America, particularly in the U.S., gasoline is TOO CHEAP! Don't get me wrong, I get pissed off every time I have to pay more, but that is and will always be the reason why granny and grandpa drive a Ford Excursion down to Florida every winter...because they can afford it! Let's face it - you look at the income of the average person who drives a large SUV in North America, then compare that to what they spend on fuel.

I just can't believe there are people on this board calling people with other SUVs wasteful. Anyone here could switch to a small wagon that would bring you at least 8 more mpg without much of a change in interior space. We're driving unaerodynamic vehicles with engines that are larger than they need to be and that have 4wd systems we probably don't need. Just because ours waste less gas than theirs doesn't mean that we're not wasting gas. I don't see CR-Vs as any more noble than an Excursion.

[stevedebi]

I just can't believe there are people on this board calling people with other SUVs wasteful. Anyone here could switch to a small wagon that would bring you at least 8 more mpg without much of a change in interior space. We're driving unaerodynamic vehicles with engines that are larger than they need to be and that have 4wd systems we probably don't need. Just because ours waste less gas than theirs doesn't mean that we're not wasting gas. I don't see CR-Vs as any more noble than an Excursion.

I suppose it is a matter of perspective. Many of us wanted an SUV, but did not want the huge tank or poor mileage. It depends upon what one is doing with the vehicle. I use mine for occaisional poor weather driving, and it gets better mileage than my minivan got, plus is more maneuverable.

We drive the CR-V because we like the SUV platform and because it is a free country (or at least the USA is a free country). If I had wanted a "small wagon", I would have bought one. I didn't want it, or buy it.

One could ask why anybody drives an SUV, but that is beside the point. Life is more than MPG, though I think we should increase the CAFE requirements.

The point is that, if one is to drive an SUV, why not get one that has twice the gas mileage of an Excursion? Unless you need the larger engine for towing, or larger cargo weight capacity, of course. The plain fact is that the CR-V is a great compromise between size and mileage. Personally, I think that a 50% improvement in mileage is pretty "noble", especially given the fact that if the CR-V didn't exist, people might well be driving a larger and less efficient vehicle, simply becasue there was no other SUV choice.

[jasbus]

As the discussion of these matters enters the general population, and they start making decisions (purchase decisions, political decisions, etc.) based on their beliefs, we will find ourselves in more and more trouble if a clear understanding is not common.

People must clearly understand the differences between an energy source, an energy storage/transport mechansim, and an energy conversion mechanism.

Quite right, I was just making a tongue in cheek observation....

In the end, it's not us as a voting public or the politicians. It's purely $$, car manufacturers and more so oil companies push billions of dollars, and that's not gonna change period.

[N_Jay]

As the discussion of these matters enters the general population, and they start making decisions (purchase decisions, political decisions, etc.) based on their beliefs, we will find ourselves in more and more trouble if a clear understanding is not common.

People must clearly understand the differences between an energy source, an energy storage/transport mechansim, and an energy conversion mechanism.

In the end, it's not us as a voting public or the politicians. It's purely $$, car manufacturers and more so oil companies push billions of dollars, and that's not gonna change period.

Nope, its the people VOTING with their $$, and its the politicians that the people VOTE into office that make the stupid laws the distort the free market that slows (but does not stop) the effect of the people VOTING with their $$!

No conspiracy here, if someone comes up with a better solution they will get plenty of backers wanting to invest.

There are far too many examples to list, where the underdog with the RIGHT (sometimes better, sometimes not) solution for the market has displaced the incumbent leader.

[Einstein]

Effective gas mileage is (persons+stuff) transported time miles driven, divided by gallons used.

If you drive a big vehicle and you keep it filled with people (carpool, family, etc.) , your effective gas mileage is higher than two people riding in an Insight.

[stevedebi]

Effective gas mileage is (persons+stuff) transported time miles driven, divided by gallons used.

If you drive a big vehicle and you keep it filled with people (carpool, family, etc.) , your effective gas mileage is higher than two people riding in an Insight.
I am assuming all playing fields equal when comparing a large SUV with the CR-V: two adults, two kids, luggage.

You are correct, which is why busses are so efficient, even though they burn a lot of gas.

[autox02altima]

We drive the CR-V because we like the SUV platform and because it is a free country (or at least the USA is a free country). If I had wanted a "small wagon", I would have bought one. I didn't want it, or buy it.

One could ask why anybody drives an SUV, but that is beside the point. Life is more than MPG

Unless you need the larger engine for towing, or larger cargo weight capacity, of course.

That's my point. People driving Excursions would make the same points - it's a free country, life is more than MPG, and I need the capability Excursions provide. CR-V drivers may be higher on the moral ladder than a Hummer driver, but there are a lot more people above us than below us. Not that I have a problem with SUVs - if I did I obviously wouldn't have one. I just think we need to be careful about casting stones at others that have made the same choices and done the same balancing of factors that we have.

[CRIANA]

I think when people are frustrated about Excursion drivers and such. It's when your passing them on the road and they have one person driving them on the cell phone and it's they're "bop around town" vehicle. They didn't buy the SUV because they have 8 kids. It's because they could afford it. It's the same mentality with houses today, buy as much house as you can get for your money, not what you NEED but what you can get.

I love the Pilot and I could even squeek it into my budget, but I don't need it. I'm constantly torn by my love of driving and driving in dirt, with my desire to preserve the environment. Do I hike the path or drive the path. I like the look of SUVs and trucks. I couldn't justify a pick up when I was car shopping. And I wanted something slightly bigger than the Prius, but still economical and for me that was a CRV. I do not drive wagons. The only car I'll drive in a wagon is Saab, and I don't have the money to put out for that.

It is absolutely correct, our power to make change is not as strong with voting for politicians as voting with our wallets. Money talks, and consumers have power, more power than they realize.

If anyone knows of a way to become a virtual employee or telecommuter, let me know, because that I'd love. And would also be cutting back on my mileage and gas consumption.

[Racoon]

If anyone knows of a way to become a virtual employee or telecommuter, let me know, because that I'd love. And would also be cutting back on my mileage and gas consumption.
It's very dependent upon your job and the company you work for. I'm a technical consultant with a software company. Right now, 1/2 to 3/4 of the time I work out of my home office in Indianapolis. The rest of the time I have to be onsite at a client, or at one of our regular offices.

The nearest company office to me is in Nashville, TN. My team manager works from her home (when she's not traveling) about 80 miles north of Salt Lake City, UT. The group manager lives about an hour south of Rochester, NY and the division manager lives an hour or so west of Philadelphia, PA. My nearest co-worker lives just north of Indianapolis (I live to the south), but he's not on my team. I know him and have worked with him, but I don't see or talk to him regularly. The nearest member of my team lives in upstate NY. We have about 1,200 employees. Somewhere around 1/4 to 1/3 of those are classified as "remote" and work from their homes. And not all of the remote employees are traveling consultants. We have a number of client support/help desk people who are remote.

Broadband/high speed internet connections have really made telecommuting a reality, and with hotels starting to add free high speed connections, even working from a hotel is no longer painful. In fact, I'm writing this from a Marriott Courtyard hotel in Salt Lake City using a high speed wireless connection with a free loaner wireless card provided by the hotel. At home, I have high speed cable access, which my company pays for.

"Group ware" software has also had a big impact, as it allows for virtual meetings and discussions about projects. We use a secure instant messaging product for a lot of quick discussions, and for more formal meetings or training we have a virtual classroom setup that is very cool. I'm teaching an end user training class the end of January for a client in a fairly remote area. They're in a small, single traffic light sized town about 1.5 hours South of Rochester, NY. Instead of the client having to pay for me to travel to them, at the appointed time they'll sit in front of their computers and go to a specific web site and login. They'll then dial an 800 number and enter an access code to join a conference call. I'll be connected remotely to their computer system, and they'll be able to see everything I do, including the Powerpoint training materials, and the hands on demo on their system. I can even assign control to one of the attendees so I (and everyone attending) can watch them do an exercise or show me how they're doing something. And one of my colleagues in San Diego, CA is going to "sit in" on the training, too.

Ask your boss. If most of your job is sitting in front of a computer, there's at least the possibility of doing some of your work from home.


Did I mention that I love my job? :D

[Gopal]

Effective gas mileage is (persons+stuff) transported time miles driven, divided by gallons used.

If you drive a big vehicle and you keep it filled with people (carpool, family, etc.) , your effective gas mileage is higher than two people riding in an Insight.
I am assuming all playing fields equal when comparing a large SUV with the CR-V: two adults, two kids, luggage.

You are correct, which is why busses are so efficient, even though they burn a lot of gas.

IMHO, The above is the BEST solution possible for convenient transportation with environmental preservation. Our public transport system sucks. In Texas, it is practically non-existent. In Lubbock, one would starve if one didn't posses a car! Yet, look at people's attitude, even with a the thread-bare system the buses runs empty!!

Yes, this would cut down on our percieved "privacy"/"freedom" etc., but if people care and the govt. cares, IMHO, an efficient public transport system is the first step to control pollution. Given a choice, I would hop into a bus any day for daily commute....and use my dear V for grocery purchases.

Regards,
Gopal

[stevedebi]

That's my point. People driving Excursions would make the same points - it's a free country, life is more than MPG, and I need the capability Excursions provide. CR-V drivers may be higher on the moral ladder than a Hummer driver, but there are a lot more people above us than below us. Not that I have a problem with SUVs - if I did I obviously wouldn't have one. I just think we need to be careful about casting stones at others that have made the same choices and done the same balancing of factors that we have.

You know, I thought that myself as I was typing: "This could be said by an Excursion owner".

However, I like to think that I make do with the least possible vehicle as I can. For me this was the CR-V. I believe very few people NEED a large SUV (except for those towing & large families).

Also, driving one of those large SUVs is an interesting thing. I rented an Expedition once, and had to keep reminding myself that this was a large vehicle, and to make sure I didn't intimidate the smaller cars. Otherwise I found myself forgetting that this was a really large car and drove too aggressively.

[Blaine1437]

i wouldnt mind a hybrid that has 470+hp like the concept eclipes E,