CRV EX and mountainous terraine

[etara]

Can anyone help? I now live in NYC; drive a '94 Accord EX. Am moving upstate in a year. Want to buy a new Honda. My Accord fades out fast on mountainous terraine. No pep upstate, but drives like a dream in NYC.

I test-drove the Outback. Hated it. Rides like a bus. On a whim I test-drove the 2004 CRV. Loved it in NYC BUT CAN IT HANDLE mountainous terraine? I know the Subaru Outback can, but it really rides like a bus.

Anyone out there have any info or experience? CRV has 4 cylinder, 160 hp. I've asked dealers here, but they honestly do not know what mountains and dirt roads are like. I mean "up and down" all the way.

THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BTW, what is the HRV?[/b]

[chiph]

The HRV is not available in the US market -- it's a smaller cousin to the CR-V.

I think if you get your CR-V with a manual transmission you won't have any problems with mountainous terrain. Even with the automatic, you'd have to be talking about some seriously steep roads to cause it problems. Will it slow down in the mountains? Sure, all vehicles will. But all you'd have to do is drop it down one gear.

The load in the vehicle counts for alot, too. If you've got 4 large people in there plus their stuff, you're going to have problems even in something like a Grand Cherokee.

Chip H.

[bumpzter]

The Outback rides like a bus? What kind of bus would that be?

If you planning on doing a lot of 'mountainous terrain' driving, you probably won't be happy in the long run.

[HIPSI]

8) I live in the southern appalachians, which has some of the greatest elevation changes east of the Mississippi. Our interstates around here have long grades with 7% and 7.6% slopes. Our local roads are really hilly. I ride a mountain bike, and ride on some paved roads with 22% grade!!! I have a '04 CRV EX automatic, and the two lane roads give me no problem at all. On the interstate, on the steep long (5 miles for the 7.6% grade)it taxes the CRV to go 70mph all the way up. That said, going 65mph all the way up is no problem. Here's why: The CRV will downshift at the bottom of the mountain, from a normal cruising RPM of 2700 at 70mph, to 3200 RPM at 70mph. As the slope gets steeper, the CRV will have to shift to approx. 4300 RPM to maintain the 70mph speed. I can, however, run 65mph all the way up the mountain with only the first downshift, to 3200rpm. These are some of the steeper grades you will encounter on an interstate highway. I forgot the actual rule, but the 7.6% is pretty steep. And it does make a diffrence as to how many passengers you have or how much equipment you're carrying. I hope this helps. BTW: I am very happy with the performance of my CRV (4000 miles) in this hilly terrain. We have a delta in elevation of about 3500 ft, from about 500 ft above sea level to around 4000 ft above sea level.

[etara]

Daer Greg;

Thanks a lot. I love Honda, and the CRV rides great here in flat NYC. From what you are telling me it should perform just fine in the Catskills, since the back roads are too winding to go faster than 65 mph anyway.

Any thoughts on rollover? The Outback has a nice low center of gravity. CRV looks higher and riskier, but is more fun to drive. A little encouragement and I'm sold!

Much thanks;

Ellen

[etara]

The Outback rides like a bus? What kind of bus would that be?

If you planning on doing a lot of 'mountainous terrain' driving, you probably won't be happy in the long run.

Big, powerful, sluggish bus. Outback has little sound insulation between engine compartment and passenger compartment, so the minute you start it up you hear the engine. I do not know why, but it continuously "turns over" at "neighborhood" speeds. This gives it a sluggish feel. I'm guessing that the engine does not give full power until the car is up to 40 mph.

I plan to use the CRV EX as follows:

1. Stop and go here in lovely NYC
2. Driving down to Florida
3. Mountainous terrain (sorry about the misspelled word). No hauling. Just a "get-about" car with guts enough to hold up and go over 50 mph on paved back roads.

Also, any thoughts on rollover?

Thanks again,

Ellen

[bluemonster]

I love the V in the mountains of New York.....it kicks ass even with 4 people on the steep roads:
http://www.criana.com/crv/nemc/gallery/fall2003

[bobot]

hmmm. i know everyone here loves the V.... but i got bring out the negative part.

on my way back to vancouver from the whitler bike park... there's an uphill w/ a passing lane and i tried to pass this old volkwagen jetta and my 2003 automatic V couldn't pass it. I had the pedal to the floor since every passing lanes are few in this mountainous road so everyone pretty much guns it when they have the oppurtunity. needless to say i was disappointed.

my ROUGH analysis on this: i was going at a speed the lower gear can't handle (max rpm) so it's on this gear (4th i think) but the engine is having a problem providing enough power to pull it up fast.

a nissan v6 pathfinder wouldn't have this problem. actually my bike buddy who use to have a 2002 V sold his V and got just that after a year. his complain on the V? lack of passing power and torque. 4 bangers just aren't powerful enough.... unless w/ a turbo.

it all depends on how u like to drive.

[bluemonster]

Egads, I have a stick and I'd be bummed if mine did that, and it hasn't I just shift down to 4th....seems wierd to me. Your's should have downshifted and been able to handle passing an old Jetta since it's relatively new....

[bobot]

well depending on how fast your speed is to begin with, downshifting will be out of the rpm working range. i have an automatic. my old turbo legacy would kicked some ass. :D

[Dru690]

Ellen,
I live in the Catskills, in Woodstock... I have a '97 CR-V which does just fine on every type of road around here, paved, gravel, dirt, etc. It's short on power going up hills, but the G2 V, especially with a 5-speed (which is the way to go, out of NYC of course), shouldn't be as bad.
Nonetheless, Bobot has a point. If you want performance, get a V-6 powered SUV or, all buzzing and loud noises aside, a Subaru with a turbofour...

[bluemonster]

I'd also point that an older 97 has much less power than the 2nd Gens. Drop by the Kingston Honda Dealership on 9W. They're nice guys! Take the V out across the Thruway to 28 and then go up some of the side roads in the Catskills. I swear the V has enough oomph :!:

If you want, I'd take you (and Dru690 and anyone else interested) out for a spin. I know a steep paved road and lots of easy dirt! PM me if interested....The picture in my signature (below) is just 5 miles from downtown Kingston!

[kwc]

Spent a week in Colorado this summer with my 02 V, family. First day, using 86-octane, it drove like a dog. Next day, used 89-octane, was much better. Wonder if the engine computer was getting used to the altitude? I learned to keep the O/D switched off also, which keeps the AT from getting "lost".

BTW, she doesn't do to bad off-road either. We can go anywhere the Sube's can go! Stay away from the Big Rocks, you will be fine.

[etara]

BTW; I test-drove the Outback again. Seems the first dealer was playing "bait and switch" since he offered Outbacks at the same price as Foresters, then let me test-drive a "rigged to fail" Outback. The second car, at a different dealer, drove very smoothly, solidly and quietly. Has power, lacks pickup. And features, like heated mirrors and wiper blades, that I don't need. Prefer the moon roof and primo sound in CRV.

I still prefer the CRV. Still has better pickup than Subaru around here.

What year did they switch to the 160 hp model?

What is O/D switch?

Thanks.

Ellen

[gtl7001]

To answer your question, they switched to the bigger 160hp engine from 2002 on. Also, it is not only the horsepower of the engine that gives the vehicle acceleration or passing power. The torque of the engine is just as important. Usually the amount of horsepower and torque of an passenger car engine go hand in hand. Truck engines are a different story. The generation 2 CRV's that is model years 2002 to 2004 have approximately the same horsepower and torque. This is quite a lot for a 4 cylinder engine. In fact, it is comparable to 6 cylinder engines 15 years ago. However, 6 cylinder engines have advanced in technology. I own both a 2001 Accord V6 EX and a 2004 CRV LX and have not had any problems going up the mountains in NY or in PA. In fact, the automatic in the Accord is sometimes sluggish because the automatic transmission is hunting for the right gear. The CRV that I have is a manual transmission and does not do that. My suggestion is to get a manual tranny CRV, you will not be sorry you did. If you do not know how to shift gears in a manual, the Honda 5 spd' are one of the smoothest and forgiving MT out there and it is a good vehicle to learn on. By the way I also test drove the Subaru Outback and Forrester and I was not really impressed. Good luck

[Shel]

etara/Ellen,
I'm from upstate NY and my 04 mt CRV performs very well there. I didnt have that much of a problem with my 94 EX Accord Vtec, as I was always happy to plow past vehicles on the various uphill roads, even with the lower hp of the '94.

my $0.02

[etara]

Thanks for the tip. I reach high school bio, and of course took physics, so I guessed that torque was acceleration. With cars, I guess its acceleration at a given speed -- ie from a dead stop versus from 50 to 80 mph. Subarus (which are regarded as "quirky" here) seem to have plenty of power, but little torque at slow speeds.

I really don't need to feel the power of a Hummer (yes, people drive them in the 5 boroughs. Very silly people). I just do not want a car like my current Accord, which is a dream on flat land, and a cry baby after a few hills.

BTW, any thoughts on rollover risk in the CRV????????? I know the new ones are wider. This is the one plus of Subaru. Low center of gravity.

Thanks again.

[bluemonster]

NHSTA gave it 3 of 5 stars:
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/NCAP/Cars/2017.html

That appears to be better than a lot SUVs, many got only 2 stars:
http://www.cars.com/carsapp/national?srv=parser&act=display&tf=/features/2003overview/suvs/safety.tmpl

It's not a car, so I don't take curves quite as fast as I did in my other cars.

[kwc]

O/D Switch - there is a button on the end of the A/T shifter that will disable the OverDrive. Wife wanted an automatic, she won't drive a manual in Houston traffic. Can't blame her, really.

[Vigor25]

yes, the cr-v has the O/D switch mounted at the end of the shifter

[CRIANA]

BTW, any thoughts on rollover risk in the CRV????????? I know the new ones are wider. This is the one plus of Subaru. Low center of gravity.

Thanks again.

I've driven 2 first gens and now my current 2nd gen CRV. I've never felt the feeling of roll over, I drive it hard on the windy roads of CT. My brakes tell the story. It will take a little adjusting to, when I went from driving a Saab 9-3 to the CRV, I had to shift my driving style, but you'll adjust and get comfortable with how it handles.

My mother (this is not something to be proud of), has managed to crack up 2 CRVs, neither time did she roll it. Guard rail in a snow storm, and then totalling a 2002 on a bridge. Both accidents she walked away unscathed, neither did the vehicle roll and she gave it opportunities to do so.

As long as when your driving you remember your driving an SUV and not a corvette, you'll be just fine :-)

[etara]

I hate to sond dumb, but WHAT IS OVERDRIVE?? I think I may have owned a car with it, never used it, and do not know what it is. How's that for "space cadet"! A friend tells me that, when it is on, the car has less pep and uses less gas. A Honda salesman told me that it enables the car to downshift when going uphill automatically.

DUHHH!! Can anyone help?
Should I testdrive with it on or off?

[CR-Vince]

Overdrive is the automatic transmission's highest gear. The car doesn't have to rev as high when in steady cruising situations. Are you familiar with riding a 10-speed bike? If so, imagine what it would be like to be unable to shift into higher gears when crusing on flat roads. You could do it, but with higher gears you could do so with less effort.

Only switch overdrive off only when you know for a fact that using the high gear makes no sense. This usually means very hilly terrain or towing. Leave OD on when you test drive.

[nvmah]

Criana,
Sab 9-3's are nice cars. Do you enjoy driving the CR-V more?

[CRIANA]

nvmah,
hmmmm....well it's kind of hard to compare. I'd love it if my CRV had the turbo my Saab had. But I have to say the 2nd gen V's do a good job with peppi-ness and I spun out several times when I first got it :-D

I do love driving my CRV, especially since the Saab I could never take down dirt roads 8)

[nvmah]

True enough. The CR-V is just youthful and fun to drive!

[peahen]

I was going to make this comment a few weeks ago...I live in a hilly terrain. I went from a V8 to the 160hp CR-V! Although the V8 could easily find more power to pass on a hill, the CR-V is no slug either.

The automatic shifting between 4th and 3rd and back is so smooth it's unbelievable. I especially cannot feel the change between 4th to 3rd.

I have never not been able to pass, but I also don't need to be driving faster than these speed demons do! And I typically drive faster than the speed limit!

People here call the terrain features "mountains", but being from southern California, they look more like "hills" to me!

[etara]

Dear Heidi;

Thanks. You also answered two of my other questions. I wondered why the CRV has no D3 or D4. I guess it goes there automatically.

Also I notice that you want the mirror/compass/temp thing. So do I. This is a nice Subaru feature that Honda should add. (And forget the picnic table. I plan to keep so much stuff in my CRV that it would never be worth emptying it all out to get to that table).Let me know if you find one. I think this would be fun to have.

[etara]

Thanks to everyone who has replied to my posts. I'm pretty much sold onthe CRV since, afterall, I'll be spending most of my time here in NYC anyway.

Which brings me to my next comment. There are somany Honda dealerships here that they hound you once they get your name. One of the biggest has tons of complaints against it, including selling demos as new. You'd think a "class act" like American Honda would pull their franchise. One really has to be careful.

It also seems, theft-wise, that the CRV will be the new "Accord".
I plan to add glass sensor and door alarms to existing system. Has anyone done this?

Do not plan to have dealer do it.

[Shel]

Also I notice that you want the mirror/compass/temp thing. So do I. This is a nice Subaru feature that Honda should add. (And forget the picnic table. I plan to keep so much stuff in my CRV that it would never be worth emptying it all out to get to that table).Let me know if you find one. I think this would be fun to have.

etara, I know you can order it from collegehillshonda.com

[etara]

Thanks!

[peahen]

Also I notice that you want the mirror/compass/temp thing.

http://www.sportsimportsltd.com/autdimrearvi.html
http://www.caraccessories.com/buy/001926elcm/compass_mirror.html
http://www.autosportcatalog.com/index.cfm?fa=p&pid=1178

I don't know if a CR-V compatible model is available at all these sights. You could also check your local truck accessory place.

[Hhessler]

Here in Colorado I have had my CRV,5 spd, on old railroad grades at 12,000 feet with no problem. It is not a race car, but it will handle rough mountain roads OK with the standard transmission. So I can imagine nothing in New York that would cause it too many problems.

[etara]

Thanks. Mountains in NY are in watershed and actually are quite high
(2000ft). Up and down. I am looking at the AT, since I do not drive manual, and if I did, I would not want to drive it in NYC where traffic is to be expected.

Any chance the 2005 will have more horse power? 160 is at the low end of what is out there, esp among American cars. Altima has 200hp

My take is that other engine features, besides pure hp, determine actual working power of car. Any thoughts?

[Hhessler]

I think the 160 hp will be more than enough for you.

[gpinzone]

Mountainous terrain? The only small SUV that can truly handle tough terrain is the Jeep Liberty. It doesn't score high on overall reliability, but it is designed more like a "jeep" than a truck or car.

I love my new CR-V and I have no need to drive it up mountains, but if I did, I would definately want to test drive it in those conditions myself before I made the purchase. Don't rely on anecdotal evidence. Research the vehicles through Consumer Reports and/or some other trustworthy publication.

[etara]

I meant mountainous roads. Paved, but steep. I do not plan do go off road. Consumer Reports rates its engine as more powerful than some competitor's "in-line six cylinders".

I actually bought the CR-V last night. Very impressed with its power when I drove it home. Although I have not driven it upstate, I've seen others do so, so I'm hoping it'll be OK.

Wish me luck!
A. Cr-V performs well on hilly roads
B. CR-V is where I left it last night. Have not added alarm to it yet. :)


Thank s!

Ellen

[Hhessler]

Fear not, you will have no trouble driving on roads that are only 2000 ft. high. I live in Denver, and it is 5280 ft. high. I-70 goes through the mountains and has a tunnel at the continental divide with an approach road of 7% and an elevation of well over 11 thousand ft, and my CRV with 5 spd will go up this interstate at 75 mph. So don't worry, and enjoy!

[etara]

Thank you!

So far I love it -- although I have not left Queens, and have not had the opportunity to go faster than 40 mph!

Plan to scoot upstate next wekend! It will feel great to be in a new, reliable car.

Enjoy your day

Ellen in NYC

[BackRoadButler]

Having had various car/trucks and dirt bikes, my 2004 CR-V 4 banger has 160 hp of pep for the hills and passing in the Berkshires. I guess it's about how one drives the vehicle. The auto transmission wasn't my choice as much as my wifes. I'd prefer the manual shift allowing me to rev out the gear and power band. However, I do not have any problems with auto, "D" and go! As with all SUV or trucks, you want to race get a muscle car.

[Cadd]

I got mine from Bay Ridge Honda in Bklyn. Speak to Keith. He's a good guy. I got $1,200 off when everyone is doing $500 off MSRP back in 2002.

But don't bring it to Bay Ridge for maintenance....they suck. Try to avoid SI Honda......heard they love playing games.

If you think your Accord is not good enough for roads Upstate which consist of rolling hills, I don't think the CR-V will do any better than your Accord. The V has only approx 15HP and 15lb/ft of torque more than your Accord. BUT the V weighs over 500lbs more than your Accord. So the minimal gain in HP and torque is already offset by the weight difference. If that's not bad enough, the V isn't exactly very aerodynamic. You'll get a lot more wind resistance with the V than you would with your more aerodynamic Accord.

If you're concerned with powering up those hills, I suggest you getting a more meatier engine such as the Pilot's V6 or the Toyota's Highlander with the V6. You'll have more torque which will enable you to keep up the MPH without having to downshift as often. Good luck with your search. BTW, personally, I've driven the vehicle Upstate a few times times with CRIANA, Bluemonster, Rudy, Klynch & Goongla Ron and find its power to be adequate. I've driven to the White Mountains area in NH and found it to be just fine with 4 adults in the car.

It's really up to you. But don't expect it to have a lot more power than your Accord.